Steve Hutt (02:18):
Hey, there it's Steve. And welcome back to the eCommerce Fastlane podcast. Now if this is your first time listening, this is an e-commerce show where we have honest and transparent conversations about building and thriving with your store powered by Shopify or Shopify Plus. New episodes are available twice weekly with your favorite podcast player through Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, Google Play, and Spotify, or you can also sign up online at and be notified when a new show is being released. My guest in today's episode is Sahil Gupta who is the CEO from Spase. That's spelled s, p, a, s, e. They are a technology company that is leading and innovating the way for e-commerce brands to help create engaging 3D models for products.

Steve Hutt (03:04):
I'm sure you've seen this. Apple's been talking about it. Shopify has been talking about it. There's some very progressive brands that have made the decision to have a 3D rendered image available for more engagement to really have a look at the product and really helps with conversion. So we're going to dig into a lot of things around this and the acronyms around 3D, AR, and virtual reality. There's so much to talk about. So let's welcome Sahil to show.

Sahil Gupta (03:30):
Hi, Steve. Great to meet you and thanks for having me.

Steve Hutt (03:32):
So let's talk first on a high level about what Spase actually does and why you built the company. And I guess the sort of problems that you believe that your platform is now solving for Shopify store owners.

Sahil Gupta (03:46):
I started Spase in 2019 with the goal of solving this problem that merchants had, which was they wanted to sell in 3D and AR and VR, but didn't know how to digitize their products. They didn't know how to turn photos of their product into a model that they could host on their website and share with their customers. So that was an opportunity that I saw where somebody had to be responsible and somebody had to build a system that could create models that were both beautiful, photorealistic. I guess those are the two things, but if I could add another, that were also lightweight and that just plain worked. So I started Spase to turn photos into models, and we found a lot of opportunity with Shopify. Shopify made a big part of their initiatives in 2019 to move the 3D program forward. And while they were supporting the viewer aspect, which means that if you had a store, you could host your models. The question still remained, who would make the models? So that's why I really started Spase, to make models.

Steve Hutt (05:01):
Yeah. I love it. I remember watching the live stream at Shopify Unite, which is the partner conference. And I know that was one of the big announcements that they were talking about. Like, where does the data go? How do you produce them? Why is Shopify getting involved with 3D and AR and VR, which we'll talk about in a second. Why is that? And I also remember Tim Cook, even showing up to the office and, you know, there was quite a bit of fanfare from Apple when he showed up and some kind of partnerships and things that were starting to develop between what Apple was working on and what Shopify was working on. It was an interesting synergy that started to happen. And so I see how you're positioning yourself now into a market that is starting to expand and grow. So that's really exciting. So let's maybe unpack that a bit and just talk about your background because it really does fascinate me about, you know, why people kind of build what they build. So are you able to talk about what positions you, I guess, number one, to have the desire, number two, maybe to have the expertise, to even want to create this platform.

Sahil Gupta (05:59):
A lot of things had to happen to get to the date where I decided to start Spase. And I think some of those things were an interest in what's happening in technology and the ability to think about what could work and what can't work. You have to have a very big filter for what can't work and also the opportunity sort of really within sight. So for each of those things with, you know, what's happening in technology, what I saw before I started Spase was a big move and a big focus towards 3D, whether that was in AR or VR or on the software side. And also on the hardware side with Oculus coming out, with every new generation of iPhone and Android supporting AR, and with some really cool web frameworks, like A-Frame and Mozilla Hubs gaining traction where websites were becoming 3D. So that was something that was happening. And then in the context of that, I was thinking, what could I do that would be both cool and useful. And this goes to the third point as to, you have to see something on the horizon that is actually real. And that was Shopify's announcement that they're going to turn on the 3D viewer for their million merchants. And there's a missing piece there and that missing piece is, all right, somebody has to make the models. And everything just came together at that point in time. I knew I could do it. I knew I could find really great people, and I knew I'd like working with those people. And then the second point was yes the ability to filter out things that won't work. You really have to take the state of mind that the other folks in the tech industry are, they're not stupid they're very smart, but they are focused on the software side of things. Whether that's, you know, the HoloLens team at Microsoft or the people at Mozilla Hubs or the people at Google doing let's say AR streaming. That's going to happen. Or people that have built video game engines, they're at the peak of their field. It's very hard to do anything to contribute to that, just working, starting from zero. Whereas what was possible was trying to create a team of really great people who could make really great models. And it'd be this wedge in this 3D sort of evolution of things, which is in the creation of models. That was a hairball of ideas, but let's go deeper in any one of them, if you'd like.

Steve Hutt (08:16):
Absolutely. Well, maybe we'll talk about some of the acronyms because there's quite a few of them, maybe some of the things you've even just mentioned that some people don't even know about. And I think that's part of the education process of today's show is just understanding the industry and then trying to figure out how they can innovate and be involved in that industry, potentially even working with your company to get these models created. So let's talk about 3D first. I mean, I'd argue maybe some people listening today. I think they have a cursory knowledge of what 3D is, but you know, some people may think it's just like a series of photos taken on a lazy Susan kind of all stitched together, but from your perspective, because I know you have a definitive answer, what is 3D and what's a 3D model as it relates to your company and or Shopify brands that want to get involved in 3D.

Sahil Gupta (09:01):
Sure. I'd say 3D model is a file that represents the surface of an object. This is just one definition of many, but in the context of e-commerce, this is I think the best way to think about it. It's a file just like a JPEG or a dot DOC. In this case, it's dot GLB. You can nicely, you know, save it in your Dropbox or Windows Explorer. It's just a file. And when loaded in a renderer, it looks like the object. So the file represents the surface of the object and the way it does that is through the surface geometry. And then also the surface materials and going deeper into the geometry. It's an array of triangles, and going onto the texture side, it's a series of .jpg's themselves. So it's like the .jpg's are wrapped around the triangles, like you were painting on stone or like you're wrapping a globe in a map projection. And that's the, I think the simplest way I can describe the .glb file and that same file works in AR software kits, which means that AR will work with the exact same file. And that's the other piece of the puzzle that I found so, you know, just so wonderful that you can put a lot of effort into getting the .glb right. And that same file will work in 3D on laptops, on phones, on VR headsets. So when people move their Shopify stores into VR, which is definitely going to happen, you're going to have your .com. If your store is like, that's your store and you'll have it in VR. And the actual products will be these 3D files. And then you'll have your visitors walk through the store with their Oculus headset on. And that'll just be a really cool feature. It's like thinking about your store like a video game, and what I hope Spase will think about after we do a really great job at making models, the creation of models, very stable and very accurate, then we can look at the concept of multiplayer shopping and that'll be a little bit later, but that's just what's on my mind.

Steve Hutt (11:17):
Very cool. So let's unpack two more and acronyms that I think are floating around. A few, you mentioned already about AR and VR. I mean we know, augmented reality and virtual reality on a surface to the lay person who just has a cursory knowledge of it, it seems kind of like the same thing, but I understand that's not the case. Are you able to give your definition of what augmented reality actually is? And its practical uses today as it relates to a commerce brand, then how VR is similar but different?

Sahil Gupta (11:51):
Sure. I think the definitions keep changing, which is a good thing. Right now, AR to me is you're looking through the screen and VR is you're looking at the screen. Another division I see happening is the difference between, you know, like work and play. So when you're, so to speak working, you might want to work in VR because it's totally immersed. You'll have your 10 monitors sort of in VR and you'd be totally plugged in to what you're doing. And then there's AR, which is, let's say that's the play side. So it's like, you're going on a hike, you're maybe driving, you're outdoors and there's information superimposed on your line of sight. And in the context of e-commerce both are going to be very important. What's important now because it's just working and it's because there are the hard facts of proof by existence of the customers that we've worked with are selling in AR, it's that you take your products, you'll digitize them into a dot GLB and your customers can view them in AR on their phones.

Steve Hutt (12:52):
So it means that now they're using their camera, because I think I've seen some demos here where I saw one with a lamp or some furniture and things, some more hard goods. And I thought it was quite interesting to see how is this going to look in my particular example in my particular room and grabbing the product, and then using the camera to show your space, but then, having this item superimposed and all rendered correctly in the right angles and lighting. It really is quite impressive. And then people see it going, yeah, I like how that lamp looks there in my house. I'm going to take it. So I love that part.

Sahil Gupta (13:28):
Isn't there an Ariana Grande day song, something about, you see it, you want it, you got it? That's basically what this is, you see it and you buy it.

Steve Hutt (13:35):
Love it. So don't take this question incorrectly. I know this is your field of expertise and stuff like that, but let's talk about why does all of this matter? It seems very exciting. It seems a little bit science fiction. It seems like extra progressive, these dot GLB files you're talking about. It's very exciting. It's not widely adopted yet, but progressive brands are seeing amazing success. I've looked at them kind of prerecording today, so I know who's using it. And why. So it's interesting. I want to make sure we share that, in this episode today, but like, why does all of this matter and why is 3D and augmented reality important today for commerce brands?

Sahil Gupta (14:14):
The more on the ground reason is that it doubles customer engagement, and I'm new to e-commerce, but I've never seen that kind of a return on investment. Digitizing your product leads to a doubling of customer engagement. And then the other reason is just that they look so cool. You know, you can spin them around, you can zoom in, you can place them on your desk. Those are the softer reasons, but they're the reasons that keep me going. And it also saves on product photography. So instead of spending thousands of dollars for a professional photoshoot, once you have your digitized model, because it's photorealistic, that model can be used as the model for digital photographs. So in a tool like Adobe Dimension or a tool like even the web-based version of Google's model-viewer, you can render photoshoots of your digital model for free.

Steve Hutt (15:05):
That was kinda my next question. I'm just thinking now is about the whole process for a merchant. And there's tens of thousands of people listening to this episode today. And, you know, they may see value, hopefully by end of this show, and say hey, you know what, I want to try. I want to be a progressive brand. I want to try this out because I believe this is interesting. And so let's talk about the process that a merchant has to go through to actually create 3D models with the Spase tool.

Sahil Gupta (15:30):
The shortest process would be sending us a link to your product page. We would then extract all the information from that product page, including the photos and the dimensions. And we'd make the model just from a product link. If your product is in production or in those earlier phases, and there's no complete link, then just sending photographs around the product, like five to six photos around the product will be all the necessary input for the creation of a model.

Steve Hutt (16:00):
Super cool. So link to the product details page or five or six photos. And then from there, your technology will then import all that information. And as you said, triangulate, it all and organize it all and then create a 3D model out of it.

Sahil Gupta (16:14):
Right. And there's more than technology. There's also people. And it takes a very particular set of skills to be able to make these models. I think that there'll be a new concept coming into play, which is right now you might call them 3D artists, but it's really a form of engineering. And I think it's going to be called meshware engineering. I could be wrong, but that's how I think about it because the kind of intelligence to make models by visualizing it in your head and then actually creating it into a scene editor is a very different type of skillset from writing software or from any other trade. I think that's another reason why this is so important, not just from the fact that it doubles customer engagement or that the models are just so cool to look at. It's the fact that it's, there's a whole new way of thinking about what you see and that's really the three-dimensional way of seeing things. I also think that this is a way for people to, this is a weird way to say it, but to keep busy, you know, to be working, even in a future where a lot of work is automated. Making 3D models, it can be work. And it's the same skillset that's the reason that we have special effects in movies and television. The reason we have environments and video games, and now that's coming to e-commerce.

Steve Hutt (17:26):
Yeah, it seems like a natural progression. You're right about when you look at a lot of the games that are out in 3D and all the special effects and things that are happening, and this is just computer to their virtual reality is quite interesting. So let's talk about the industries because when I look around the web, even a lot of the popular Shopify stores, it appears on the surface. And I think you, and I don't have the inside view of, you know, your list of clients and customers that are making the choice to use your tool. But on the surface, I see, I call them the usual suspects in certain industries that I think have widely adopted the use of 3D models, like things in fashion and home. And maybe even a lot of furniture companies because of their physical hard goods and they appear to be rendered well, and they look good in virtual reality setting the lamp or the picture or whatever, the furniture moving it around. And it's interesting. And so from your perspective, do you see all product verticals being adopted or are there only certain ones at this point that can offer the most value?

Sahil Gupta (18:28):
I do see it happening across all product verticals. It'll definitely get started most easily in hard surface goods, the kinds of goods where if you drop it, it keeps its shape. So that could be furniture, that could be hardware parts, car parts, that could be computers and electronics. It could be iPhone cases, anything that really keeps its shape. Where there's still work to be done is in fashion. And the real question is how is that going to be humanized? Are we going to be having animated, you know, alive looking fashion on avatars or will it be on mannequins? It's definitely hard surface goods. And then in terms of industries, it's not just e-commerce, but growing in retail in marketing in advertising, and if you take a look at Google Swirl, that's their 3D ad initiative. And it doesn't take a lot of imagination to see that once advertising gets ahold of 3D and AR, once that goes mainstream, there'll be no shortage of demand for 3D content.

Steve Hutt (19:30):
So I understand those verticals now, and it seems to be, those are the ones that I see the most hard goods seem to be easy, as you said, if you can drop it and it doesn't break, or the, you know, the outside edges don't collapse. And so I totally get that part. And that completely makes sense. But now let's talk about the browsers themselves, because I understand that there are ways I guess, to render some things, at least in browsers, or at least in AR like right from within a browser. So why would someone listening today want to generate a 3D model from product photos? If it can already be rendered in real time in a browser.

Sahil Gupta (20:07):
There's still a lot of visual interest to be created in really great looking photos and the ability to take a model and put it inside a virtual set, and then render that photograph can be just as visually compelling as a live rendered model. So for that reason it is possible to go from photos to model to photos. The process of making the model is almost in a sense like up-res'ing the information in the photo, which you can then render out in a scene. If your listeners have experience with Adobe dimension, just experimenting with it will make it very clear. It's just visually amazing to see a model rendered out in a digital environment with total control over lighting.

Steve Hutt (20:49):
Let's dig into some merchant stories. I've read a bunch, I'm going to put links in the show notes. Shopify has produced quite a bit of content of brands that have been progressive enough to want to try this. And then as you said, double the engagement and conversions significantly increases. So do you have any merchant stories that you can kind of publicly talk about around 3D or AR and how it's impacted sales or just, you know, brand affinity? I just would love to understand some of the outcomes that you've seen so far.

Sahil Gupta (21:23):
The cool thing is that we've seen orders across almost every industry. That if you, for example, go through a dropdown menu on like Amazon or Home Depot, every product category we've gotten probably an order from, and that includes diamond rings, racing bikes, coffee machines, men's underwear, and face masks. What was interesting is to see the timing of the first order of a face mask and what was happening in the world at the time with the knowledge of the virus spreading. Also soft drink packages and the most interesting thing to me about soft drink packaging in 3D is that, I mean, at the end of the day, it's sugar and water, but it's marketed with great labels and then it's gone one level higher with the 3D model of the labels of the sugar water. And to me, that's just so funny. We've gotten handbags, we've gotten dog kennel cages, they had some really exciting results in just the initial week that they launched their 3D model. And Shopify has a really great story page on that. I'll have to send you that link. We've gotten furniture, we've gotten faucets, we've gotten Bluetooth speakers now that they're coming in all shapes and sizes. There's a big explosion there. Electric scooters, ventilators, playground equipment, camping cookers, vape pens, that's on the menu still.

Steve Hutt (22:44):
It really does seem endless the amount of people that have adopted it. And as far as any hard results, is there anything that stands out for you?

Sahil Gupta (22:53):
We have the percentages of increases of engagement coming from Shopify, and I'd probably point you to those. We don't yet track actual metrics on our customers' websites because we don't put any tracking scripts. Though, we might offer that if customers are looking for that.

Steve Hutt (23:08):
Yeah. It's interesting way because that's the thing, the investment in it, other than the cool factor that we talked about and double the engagement, which I think is enough and on its own to want to adopt this sort of technology, but then sometimes the C-suite looks at it and says, okay, well there's X number of investment and we're rotating our product seasonally. And so it's not like a one and done kind of situation. Some brands, yes, but a lot of brands, there's some seasonality around their products or new versions. And so having to get a new link sent to you and, or five or six photos sent to you, there's certain investment that goes along with all of that. And then, so that's for the product details page, but then how do we deal with social ads, how do we implement a lot of this technology now as part of a top of funnel kind of acquisition strategy, or even a conversion strategy for those that have looked at it and maybe didn't even realize there was a 3D version available. And then that's the re-engagement sequence, you know, to get people to convert.

Sahil Gupta (24:02):
That's a totally fair concern. And it might be a misconception that there's a big capital outlay required in order to have 3D models, but from the pure cost saving perspective, the price of a model might average a hundred dollars. The price of a photoshoot per product might average $5,000. So just from the saving on the product photoshoot, it makes, 5,000 divided by a 100 sense. Whereas in the case, on the positive side, from the increase in sales, that's its own argument.

Steve Hutt (24:31):
There's many people that have a certain vertical product. So they're either, so they're the manufacturer of it, but they've also decided to expand their product mix into other verticals. And these are non-competitive, but complimentary products. It's new-ish. Now more people adopting it. Just to expand, I know Steve Madden has been doing this recently focusing on shoes, but then choosing to get involved in handbags and other accessories that are not Steve Madden branded at all. And so I think that's interesting and there's lots of case studies out there about almost creating a mini marketplace of other complimentary brands that are in alignment to kind of what you're all about. And so my thought is is that if someone listening today is selling other people's products, maybe in a dropship kind of environment, and they're willing to make the small investment to have 3D models created, is there any rights management challenges that could happen where you have the rights? Let's say, I'll use the example on your website. For example, you have a biking helmet that you use as one of your examples. And so the manufacturer has created that 3D model, but let's suppose you decide to sell maybe, you know, you're Bike Helmet "R" Us, and that's what you need. It's all you sell, but you're able to grab some 3D models from some of the suppliers of these helmets, but there may be a few that just quite aren't into it yet, or haven't made the investment yet, but you choose to want to do that. Do you see any challenges of getting the five or six product photos that you've been legally able to get? Because you're a licensed partner to sell their product. Could be dropship. Maybe you're buying in wholesale and you're fulfilling it, either or. Do you see any challenges at all about, having 3D models created, where you didn't photograph the product, but you have rights to sell it.

Sahil Gupta (26:14):
That's an interesting question. And I'm going to bet that that'll be a Supreme Court question in 10 years, but for the present day, I'd say that is a question between the dropshipper and their manufacturer. Does the dropshipper have permission to even market what they're ordering from the manufacturer, whether that's Oberlo, or a similar company. And if they have the rights to market that they have the rights to market in 3D, I would say. I might be missing something, but I think that pretty much sums it up. Because it's a surface representation of the, of the product.

Steve Hutt (26:46):
At the end of the day you're just trying to sell more. I think at the end of the day, you know, that's, I mean, it's going to add double the engagement and the conversion lift is definitely going to be there because of the engagement level, and the uniqueness of it. And that will differentiate you, those listening today, that if you don't have 3D models of your product and your dropshipping, this is an interesting opportunity to try a couple of products and see what happens. So I think that's quite interesting. So let's pivot a bit over to, I guess, the future of Spase and you know, what your North star is, I guess, for '21 and beyond. I mean, we're in the middle of a pandemic right now, commerce is massively growing and I just love to understand how your platform is going to continue to iterate over time, like any partner alignment or innovation. I just, just like to get the warm and fuzzies about how you're going to continue to, I guess, offer value and assistance as it relates to 3D models for, for Shopify brands.

Sahil Gupta (27:35):
I think the thing that won't change over time is that we'll be making models from photos. We'll only get better at that. And one way we're going to make a big step forward in that is just really shaving down the time it takes to make a model from even less input. There's some very cool work being done by researchers on neural scene representation and without giving away too much, that's the Holy Grail. But I don't think it's ever going to be a case where it will be purely automated. There will always be a human in the loop, so to speak. And that's why models will look just right. With the artists that I work with, there are much higher concepts at play in the creation of the model, whether that's the silhouette or whether that's the noise level in a texture. These are all things that differentiate a AAA game from something run-of-the-mill. What else is on the horizon? I see that there are other interesting companies in this industry focusing on the idea of an AR store, which means that you'll walk around say your apartment with your phone. And it's superimposing a store, you know, with shelves of products against your wall or in an open space. And that kind of store setup depends on 3D models in order to be able to merchandise what you're, what you're selling.

Steve Hutt (28:51):
I watched a YouTube video recently where someone was walking through a virtual mall, you know, you step up to the mall and then you would actually go in or you step up to a store and the person was pivoting around. So it was kind of virtual reality world, but it was made into, into a fashion mall. And then you went into a store and potentially you were greeted by live avatars of people that belong to that store. Like almost like instead of live chat on your website, you happen to be in the store, the virtual reality store through some kind of a tool of some sort or some kind of virtual reality world. And then you're able to chat or talk and then you're able to show some 3D models and products and then even links out to buying the product. So it's really, yeah, I think there's some interesting innovation that's happening right now, as far as how do we engage people from the digital side of things? And it looks like the starting point is just to get more people to adopt the fact that 3D models are here to stay. And I think it dips your toe in the pool, so to speak about, well, getting involved in this and doubling your engagement, opens up other opportunities in the future for augmented reality, as it relates to your products. And then just other opportunities just as technology keeps advancing.

Sahil Gupta (30:10):
With your exposure to the Shopify world, if that's something that you see, that's a very good sign. That means it's approaching soon. And this is the part of a bigger transition which Shopify was partly responsible for, but it's the transition to the visual economy. And the way Shopify really was responsible for that was for the highlighting the importance of really great photography online. And those product photographs would get shared and reshared all the way through social media and through that information stream. And now we're leveling up, we're going into 3D. We're going with representing the surface of a product and that being more important than other qualities where the reason somebody will buy a product is really cause how it looks, and how it looks in the highest possible sense, the amount of information that's encoded on the surface of it. And the reason I think that's taking place is the generation of people coming up have a much higher visual literacy, whether that's in the context of shooting short videos or playing video games, it's about video. And once video becomes the common layer of understanding, then okay, what's next? It's going to be inside the video. It's going to be the 3D content that, that gets rendered out in which you've been seeing video.

Steve Hutt (31:29):
Exciting times we're living in right now. I'm always, I always make that comment to my team when I'm chatting with them each week. Just what a time to be alive right now, just as technology continues to advance, it's an amazing time to be involved in e-commerce with the unfortunate things that have happened with the pandemic right now. And just how e-commerce adoption has been widely circulated over the last six months about the fact that the last six months or more has really accelerated e-commerce adoption by 10 years. And, you know, there was upwards of 30% of total goods and services were bought online where prior to that, it was less than 15%. And so not sure if that's here to stay, I don't believe retail is dead, but it's interesting to see that there is some opportunity out there with 3D models. So we are nearing the end of the show for today. And I know we could probably talk a lot about this because it really is an exciting, interesting opportunity for those, because I know a lot of people are not doing 3D models right now. And I think today hopefully is an awakening that this is widely adopted by your peers in your vertical. And so if you actually were to look around and see, it's very affordable and it can be done with your platform. So do you have any closing comments or any kind of takeaways? You know, those listening today, they understand what a 3D model is. They understand AR and VR and the engagement lift. A lot of those things shared quite well. What do you want to leave today with, how do you want to leave this podcast episode in the hands of the listeners today?

Sahil Gupta (32:56):
Definitely a thank you to Shopify and specifically Tobi for making this possible. In fact, one of our most recent customers came to us because of a recommendation from Tobi. And, that means a lot.

Steve Hutt (33:09):
So how can people learn more about Spase, and your platform even potentially take it for a spin? I understand that, you would like to, I guess, share an offer for those listening in today.

Sahil Gupta (33:20):
Definitely check out This is the sort of thing, where you have to see it to believe it. And once you see the 3D model in all its detail, that'll do most of the explaining. We have a new program in place for, basically a digital code coupon system. And for Fastlane listeners, if you enter "fastlane" at checkout, you'll get 10% off your first order.

Steve Hutt (33:40):
Based on this episode, I think that's the thing is like, I appreciate that discount. I also believe that, you know, you have to push yourself over the edge. So if you're listening today and you see that there's opportunity here in having a 3D model and you understand the benefits and you at least want to test it, I mean, it's a life of experimentation. That's what e-commerce is all about. And let's be innovators. Sahil has been very progressive and wanted to be involved in this industry. And obviously he's got the right engineering group behind it and is nonstop iterating on the product. So thank you. Number one for coming on the show today, I really massively appreciate it. Thank you for this offer. I think, it's just, it's very clear that, you know, you really are in tight alignment with really wanting to help Shopify brands to grow their revenue and build their lifetime loyalty. And part of it is just having more engagement on the product pages and through social ads and whatnot. So I really appreciate that. I know everybody's busy and I just thank you for taking time and sharing your knowledge and your vision and just giving back to the Shopify ecosystem.

Sahil Gupta (34:38):
Thank you, Steve. And if I could add one final thought, it's that for every merchant or every Shopify business that invests in 3D models, what they're doing is not only working on their own store, but they're jumpstarting the AR and VR revolution, because it's the content creation or the lack of it, that's been holding it back. And once that's jumpstarted, what was started in 2020 with the rise of 3D and AR and VR, it's only going to grow even faster.

Steve Hutt (35:09):
Well, once again, Sahil, thank you so much for coming on the show today.

Sahil Gupta (35:12):
Thank you, Steve.

Steve Hutt (35:13):
This episode is supported by Carro, an incredible Shopify app, that discovers all the influencers, press, and media that already love your brand. It can be customers, email, subscribers, or fans, and Carro will reveal the social footprint and influence of those that have already shown you some love. And from there, Carro makes it easy to work with influencers, communicate and distribute products to them. So you can pick the right influencers and create meaningful partnerships. To get started, you can visit or search for Carro in the Shopify app store. That's c, a, r, r, o and discover which influencers already love your brand. Well, that's it for today's episode. I'd like to thank you personally for being a loyal listener of eCommerce Fastlane. It's my hope that this podcast is offering you a ton of value through growth strategies, tactics, and exclusive insider tips on the best Shopify apps and marketing platforms. All with my personal goal, to help you build, manage, grow, and scale a successful and thriving company powered by Shopify. Thanks for investing some time today and listening to the show. I'm so proud and excited that you have a growth mindset and are a constant learner. I truly appreciate you and your entrepreneurial journey. Enjoy the rest of the week and keep thriving with Shopify.